[Trombone-l] Jazz Cimbasso

Thu Mar 13 08:16:55 CDT 2008

Right on, and more than I had time to type.  Howard, your contributions are always so terrific!

J.c.S.

---- Howard Weiner <h.weiner at online.de> wrote: 
> At 11:29 12.03.2008 -0600, Dennis Clason wrote:
> >A cimbasso is (basically) a valve contrabass trombone.  The parts (where
> >they exist, which is usually in Verdi and Puccini operas) are usually
> >covered by a tubist.
> 
> I actually didn't want to get involved  (invalved?) in this 
> discussion, but I can't let Dennis' comment go unchallenged.
> 
> The "cimbasso [that] is basically a valve contrabass trombone" has 
> nothing at all to do with the historical instrument called "cimbasso"!
> 
> Here is what I wrote during a similar discussion on the list a mere 
> ten years ago:
> 
> [self-quote]
> The term "cimbasso" has been the source of much confusion. A recent 
> article by Renato Meucci, "The Cimbasso and Related Instruments in 
> 19th-Century Italy" Galpin Society Journal 49 (1996) sheds much light 
> into the cimbasso darkness.
> 
> The name: The origin of the name is not known. Meucci writes: "There 
> can be no doubt that the terms "corno basso" and "cimbasso" were 
> synonymous. However the difference rested in a distinction of 
> terminology: while _corno basso_ was academic, found only in 
> treatises and theoretical works, _cimbasso_ was everyday musicians' 
> jargon used in scores and tutors. I wish to advance here the theory 
> that the term _cimbasso_ derives from an abbreviated form of _corno 
> basso_ (or perhaps _corno in basso_) originally written _c. basso_ or 
> _c. in basso_, whence _cimbasso_. This is indirectly confirmed by the 
> lack of consistency in spelling, which varies from _cimbasso_ (most 
> frequently) to _simbasso_ and _gimbasso_, with abbreviations such as 
> _gibas_ found in manuscript scores and documents."
> 
> What is or was a "cimbasso"? A manuscript from c. 1832 describes the
> _cimbasso_ as "a kind of serpent but of different shape, having a 
> similar range and able to play in all keys." The original "cimbasso" 
> was thus a wooden instrument (though some were apparently also made 
> of metal) in bassoon form, with a cup mouthpiece. Meucchi's article 
> shows several contemporary illustrations (with fingering charts) and 
> also a photo of one of several surviving museum instruments.
> 
> In the course of the 19th century, the "cimbasso" was supplanted by the
> ophecleide (both keyed and valved models), this in turn by the 
> bombardone and pelittone (perhaps best described as forerunners of 
> the tuba). The hitch is that all these instruments were also referred 
> to as "cimbasso"!!! Then in 1881, a valved contrabass trombone was 
> built at the request of Verdi, who didn't like the sound of the 
> "bombardon." He felt that the bombardon didn't blend well with the 
> trombones. The new instrument became known as the "trombone 
> contrabbasso Verdi." It was for this instrument that Verdi wrote the 
> parts in Otello and Falstaff.
> 
> For those who want to know more, I highly recommend Meucchi's article.
> [edit: Meucchi's article in the Galpin Society Journal is the 
> translation of an Italian-language article which includes an appendix 
> listing several hundred works, mostly operas, that call for cimbasso.]
> 
> The "Alexander cimbasso" is a whole different story. In the 1950s and 60s
> there was a fellow here in Germany, Hans Kunitz by name, who 
> developed a sort of (slide) contrabass trombone. He gave his 
> invention the name "cimbasso" because he was conviced that it was the 
> instrument Verdi intended when he designated "cimbasso" in his 
> scores. (I am aware of the chronological problems inherent here, but 
> most people have unquestioningly accepted Kunitz's assertion. I'm 
> just reporting.)
> 
> In any case, Kunitz was also active as a writer on instruments, 
> publishing a series of books on "Die Instrumentation" (Breitkopf & 
> Haertel) still available today. In the volume dealing with the 
> trombone he propagated, among other questionable things, his 
> "cimbasso" as the true bass of the trombone family. Although it has 
> to be obvious to any half-way informed reader that Kunitz was making 
> things up as he went along, his writings on the trombone form the 
> basis for much of German trombone scholarship even today (MGG, MGG2). 
> That's also the reason for the misnamed "Alexander/Thein/Kalison/ 
> etc. cimbasso," which is simply a bass/contrabass trombone.
> [/self-quote]
> 
> Howard
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Howard Weiner
> h.weiner at online.de
> http://howard-weiner.de/
> 
> Tosca jumped to a conclusion.  
> 
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