[Trombone-l] How to learn about F attachment

[Roger Hecht]

At 07:27 AM 3/7/2007, Gabriel Langfur wrote:

>I do. Mostly they are bass trombone players who commit to playing 
>low Fs on the 2nd valve or in 6th - but I also know tenor players 
>who use 6th for the low F and keep their valve slide long enough to 
>get a usable low C.
>
>Gabe

Now you know another one. I wish I had a philosophical reason, but it 
has more to do with old dogs. I was brought up on old Conn 88H's with 
springs in the slide. I always tuned the C in straight first and 
pulled in on the rare occasions I played low F in valve first. (I 
never liked the valve response low F and established the habit long 
ago of playing it in 6th whenever I could. It always felt like a 
"real" note out there.) These days no one puts springs in slides (as 
far as I know). Why not, I wonder. Reliability? Whatever the case, I 
have long played with the slide tuned in 1st and never bothered to change.


>----- Original Message ----
>From: Wayne Dyess <TexasTbone at gt.rr.com>
>To: Walter Barrett <walttrombone at optonline.net>
>Cc: Trombone-L List <trombone-l at server5.samford.edu>
>Sent: Wednesday, March 7, 2007 12:32:15 AM
>Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] How to learn about F attachment
>
>
>Actually, I don't know of any players who tune their F attachment on
>the C.
>
>It ain't called the "F" attachment for nuttin', ya know.  Like why is
>it a Bb trombone?  Do we tune best on an "A"?  I think not.
>
>
>On Mar 6, 2007, at 9:26 PM, Walter Barrett wrote:
> >
> > Tuning the F attachment usually falls into 2 camps- tune it so 2nd
> > space C is in tune. (One disadvantage to this is that F in Valve 1st
> > is then flat, and you have to play it in 6th all the time.) The other
> > camp says to tune it so that low F is in tune. The 2nd space C will
> > be sharp, but you can bring it down with the handslide, usually about
> > 1/2-3/4 inch out from regular 1st. The disadvantage to this tuning is
> > that low C (2nd leger) is more sharp than when you tune the other
> > way, and has to be lipped down even more. (That low C is usually
> > sharp, no matter which way you tune it. It's just more sharp with the
> > F in tune method.)
> >
> > I like the low F in tune method, myself. I find myself wanting the
> > availability of F in 1st AND 6th.
> >
> >
> > Walter Barrett
>
>========
>
>But yeah, the "C" will be somewhat sharp.  Overtone series... same
>reason the 2nd line "F" is sharp on the Bb side of the horn.  Duh.
>
>Al Lube laid out the overtone series great (a fine teacher I had at
>UofH).  All numbers.  Physics, but we won't go there.  Acoustics...
>whatever you want to call it.
>
>1 - fundamental.  Gotta start somewhere.  This pup better be in
>tune!  Pedal Bb.
>2 - the octave above.  Another "in-tune" note.
>3 - here is the F in the staff.  It's sharp.  Note the odd number.
>4 - another Bb.   Another note "in-tune."  Note the pattern of the
>Bb's and the numbers
>5 - the D above the staff.  Flat.  Another odd number.
>6 - the F above that.  An even number, but divide it in half and you
>get the 3.  Also sharp!
>7 - Do we really want to go there?  VERY flat.  Rarely do we want to
>play the Ab in 1st.  Avoid it babe.
>8 - The high Bb.  Another note "in-tune", if we aren't pinching to
>get it.
>
>1,2,4,8 = Bb's, in tune.
>3,6 = F (and sharp)
>5,7 = flat and very flat.
>
>
>It's all a numbers game.
>
>Translate those numbers to the F attachment, beginning with the "F"
>as your fundamental, and you find the C is sharp.  It's just gonna be
>that way.  But mercy -- don't TUNE the thing to C.
>
>That's another topic of discussion since I hear a LOT of bands tuning
>their brass to "F".  In my book, that's just flat out wrong and their
>bands don't play well in tune.  Can't imagine why.
>
>It's a Bb Trombone!!!
>Sometimes with an F attachment.
>
>So tune it that way.
>
>My two cents.
>Rant over.
>
>:-)
>--Wayne Dyess
>
>
>
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Roger Hecht 


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